Re: FN-FORUM [OT] Hunting and Countryside (was drip dry moby)

date posted 26th September 2002 15:47

i have spent the vast majority of my life in the countryside - cornwall and
devon in quite remote locations - so i am not a townie expressing
non-considered thoughts - all i am saying is that there are problems
associated with both types of areas - when people are talking about problems
associted with rural life it is as if you are neglecting the fact that there
are many problems with living in urban areas - for example crime - there is
no way that you can equate the level of crime in rural areas with the amount
of crime going on outside my door (not literally) - but someone gets shot
pretty much every weekend around here (Streatham/Brixton)

talking of higher salaries - yes if you are fortunate to be in selective
industries/on the management ladder - but there are a hell of a lot aof
people living on minimum wage in urban areas combined with the higher cost
of living is a pretty valid point i think

re:
> I think you've probably gathered by now that I've little time for the
> frequently unthought through arguments about the city being so expensive.
> Also, remember, that the average townie wouldn't even consider going into
> the country unless they could change it into the city (not uncommon). The
> average country person wouldn't ever consider going to the city unless
they
> had no choice, which most of us don't.

to say that my opinion is unthought through is frankly insulting - i have a
different view that is all

re: hunting hounds - as far as i am aware, hunting hounds are shot at what
is considered to be the end of their working life which is about three or
four years old - they are not kept as pets as they do not make good pets -
so i would disagree with what you said below:

BTW. I know of a number of hunts, horse and foot, where the dogs are well
loved and live a decently long and well cared for life. Also, many of these
dogs are far better cared for than many domestic animals where you only need
to talk to a vet or PDSA officer to realise how badly cared for they can be.

Anyone who knows otherwise and i will apologise for being misinformed - but
my basic point is that evryone has problems wether they are in the city or
in the town - this reminds me of when i was living in Northumberland and
everyone talks about how they hate southerners because they are all
comparatively well off - bollocks - go to cornwall - have a look

jd







----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Peter Mansell" [EMAIL REMOVED]
To: [EMAIL REMOVED]
Sent: Thursday, September 26, 2002 3:09 PM
Subject: Re: FN-FORUM [OT] Hunting and Countryside (was drip dry moby)


>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "jd" [EMAIL REMOVED]
> To: [EMAIL REMOVED]
> Sent: Thursday, September 26, 2002 1:57 PM
> Subject: Re: FN-FORUM [OT] Hunting and Countryside (was drip dry moby)
>
>
> > two points i would make
> >
> > firstly - fox hunting - i dont much care about the welfare of foxes any
> more
> > than i do that of rats and flies - they are/can be pests and
consequently
> > they do need controlling (even here in Streatham where they rip our
> dustbin
> > bags around), I think most people have a similar opinion but like myself
> > disagree with the whole principal of making a sport from what is
> undoubtably
> > cruel (i'm pretty sure the fox does not like being chased until it is
> > exhausted and then ripped apart), and i think that the majority of the
> > country does not believe in fox hunting for that reason (many polls have
> > backed that up) and prince charles can shove that up his arse because we
> are
> > a democracy. On the subject of cruelty - i was under the impression that
> fox
> > hounds were shot after the age of three when they were deemed to be past
> > their prime - not put down but shot - which is hardly the most loving
> > relationship between man and animal
> >
> One thing I must say about polls is that most people who spout forth
> opinions aren't qualified to do so, usually by a self centred
unwillingness
> to think or see otherpeople's viewpoints. This is an unfortunate side
effect
> of democracy and one I'm not sure can be resolved. (unless we go for the
> Pratchet view of 'one man, one vote' :) )
>
> I have no patience for people who treat hounds in the manner you have
> described, though I'm not always convinced that shooting is worse than any
> other way of killing. You have to see both to see why. Shooting is a lot
> messier, though.
>
> BTW. I know of a number of hunts, horse and foot, where the dogs are well
> loved and live a decently long and well cared for life. Also, many of
these
> dogs are far better cared for than many domestic animals where you only
need
> to talk to a vet or PDSA officer to realise how badly cared for they can
be.
>
> > secondly - there are problems associated with the countryside but there
> are
> > also many problems associated with urban life - London suffers from lack
> of
> > housing, very expensive house prices, litter and disposal, transport,
> crime
> > and higher costs of living
> >
> As someone who has lived in both rural and urban Britain there are a few
> things Id like to say here:
>
> 1. London, and other large cities, only suffer housing problems because of
> the rising population and the cost of rent/purchase. If fewer people had
to
> leave the countryside, then fewer would need urban housing. Also there are
> many properties empty because people cannot afford to buy/rent them. Both
> these things are related. If there was less pressure forcing people into
> cities, there would be less economic pressure to increase prices. Also,
> maybe more should be done to make existing housing affordable rather than
> destroying more 'green field' sites.
>
> 2. Litter - hardly something we should feel sorry for, any more than we
feel
> sorry for a student who has to cook in his/her fettid kitchen :) If people
> make a mess then they should have to live with it. One of the problems
with
> modern society is that people think they can do what they want and not pay
> the price.
>
> Mind you, it does make my blood boil when those same townie litter vandals
> go into the country and continue to make a mess. Luckily it never happened
> at our farm, but I know many people who lost stock because of poisonous or
> choking rubbish thrown from cars into fields.
>
> 3. Transport is bad, but at least you/we have it. It may not be cheap; in
> fact it is ludicrously over expensive, but it does exist which is more
than
> can be said for most rural areas. In addition, for those who are not
utterly
> incapable of walking more than 100 yards without the aid of a car most
> London areas have shops and other amenities near at hand. This is not the
> case in the country where most local shops, banks, post offices etc have
> been closed and it is not uncommon for anyone needing these little
luxuries
> to have to travel 10-20 miles each way in order to use them. Also, because
> there is virtually no public transport then they have to drive.
>
> 4. Talking about the higher costs of living, what is the problem? Usually
> wages are markedly higher. Also, I notice a rather large difference in
> prices at various super markets. Quite often it is cheaper in the city
where
> the competition is higher and the market larger. Because there is no
public
> transport, shops etc, people have to keep cars. These are not cheap items
> and are one of the best methods of getting rid of money for the single
> person. In addition we have to use more fuel which in this country is
> ludicrously taxed. If that isn't a tax for living in the country, I don't
> know what is.
>
> 5. Crime is frequently on the increase in rural areas now as the urban
slugs
> move out to avoid the cctv cameras that are being installed everywhere.
> Because rural police forces are often undermanned these crimes are just as
> likely to be left unsolved as in the city.
>
> I think you've probably gathered by now that I've little time for the
> frequently unthought through arguments about the city being so expensive.
> Also, remember, that the average townie wouldn't even consider going into
> the country unless they could change it into the city (not uncommon). The
> average country person wouldn't ever consider going to the city unless
they
> had no choice, which most of us don't.
>
>
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